Jon (and TLC) should realize he has accused his former lawyer Anthony List of some serious misconduct. If true, his lawyer could be subject to discipline, even disbarment. If not true, Mr. List should look into a defamation lawsuit against Jon (and TLC).
Jon claims Mr. List:
- Filed for primary custody when Jon never wanted that.
- Spoke to the media without Jon's permission.
All attorneys are bound by the Rules of Professional Conduct. We take an oath, facing the flag, right hands raised. Pennsylvania also has their own state ethical rules. Both rules discuss at length the attorney-client privilege. An attorney cannot reveal details of a litigation unless their client gives their permission. Jon would have had to give his permission for List to speak to the media, or List would be violating one of the most sacred duties of an attorney.
In Pennsylvania, the client has the "absolute right to direct the litigation." Attorney List had no business filing for primary custody unless Jon gave him permission. Similarly, the national rules state, "a lawyer shall abide by a client's decisions concerning the objectives of representation and shall consult with the client as to the means by which they are to be pursued." No question, an attorney should not file for primary custody without their client's permission. Did Jon really not give him permission, or is this another line TLC quickly cooked up? We think the latter.
112 sediments (sic) from readers:
Thanks for this post full of facts.
Jon will probably say that the had "discussed" filing for primary custody; but he didn't agree to go forward with it or something like that.
What I don't understand is how he vehemently didn't want the kids filmed anymore, and put a stop to that.
Now, if she is having another series with the kids....doesn't he care anymore?
Oh, that's right, it was a ploy at the time and now he realizes that lots of money can be made by having them back on TV.
I am out of excuses for Jon. He is their father. TLC is not their parent. Steve is not their parent. DWTS is not their parent. He is their parent. He and Kate. They control the kids, period. Only they're letting TLC do it. What is he so scared of? TLC might take everything away? Big whoop he doesn't work anyway. He could start over, he's basically had to anyway. He's had so many good attorneys offer to help him including Paul Peterson and List. I absolutely think he could have won his lawsuit, easily. He has NO EXCUSE not to be a man and a father right now and end this.
I don't know why he is so scared of these people. I went up and faced Kate and got pulled away by Mr. Rat Claw, I survived it. They're just stupid D-listers, they're not the FBI.
Oh by the way unfortunatly US Weekly emailed me and said they're not going to do a book signing story. There's too much going on with Kate getting voted off and other stuff. Too bad the Rat Claw story isn't out there for the world but a lot of people heard about it here. :) I have a contact there now though and she said to send her any tips.
Nan said...
Oh, that's right, it was a ploy at the time and now he realizes that lots of money can be made by having them back on TV.
If that is the case, this just goes to prove that they are exploiting their kids for $$$$$.
Admin., do you think Mr. List will just remain silent on this, or will he need to provide some sort of reponse concerning the implied allegations of misconduct. I guess what I'm asking is, what would YOU do in this situation?
Administrator~
Excellent topic! Kudos to you! You are one brave lady.
NancyB~
Just wanted to let you know I replied to your post on the previous topic. Just wanted to make sure to let you know I had replied to you. :)
I had replied right after I'd read it but it didn't show up...so I'd just replied again when Administrator started this new topic here.
Besides the obvious, what especially bothers me is that Jon screwed his late fathers friend.
KON were made for each other. Now go away and STFU!
Argh. Jon is so foolish.
Jon Gosselin Really, Truly Ready to Make Peace With Kate
Today 1:03 PM PDT by Gina Serpe
James Devaney/Getty Images; Gilbert Carrasquillo/Getty Images
Jon Gosselin's seen the light? Eh, probably just the legal bill.
The unemployed octodad announced via Twitter today that he has canned his attorney and will attempt to win his latest legal battle all on his own, using nothing more than his wits and charm.
No need to suppress your laughter, we'll wait. All good? OK, then…
"Mr. Anthony List Sr., Esq. is not my representing attorney; I terminated him on April 15, 2010," Gosselin tweeted. "He has no legal right to speak to the press or anyone on my behalf.
"Kate, her attorneys and I are moving forward to work out things privately and amicably."
Funny how this change of heart comes only after Kate Gosselin danced her way out of posing a threat to Jon's press-hungry ego.
There's still no word (or corroboration) from Camp Kate as to whether or not she's on board with the amicable schtick. She returned to her Reading, Pa., headquarters from California today and then quickly took off again without speaking to reporters. But given Jon's shoddy history with communicating, we're guessing this news will come as a surprise to her.
Another surprise, no doubt, will be Jon's new claim that, despite his most recent legal filing, he never wanted to strip Kate of her custody. (Jon failing to take responsibility, on the other hand, will come as a shock to no one.)
"I never wanted primary custody, [List] filed for that," he tells TMZ. "I only wanted a more flexible custody schedule so I could be with my kids."
List, however, is calling foul on the remarks, and says that Jon's tweets are the first he's heard that his services are no longer required.
"The only thing I know is what I read in the blogs today and that he is going to handle it privately," List tells E! News.
"I was shocked because we were making some progress. I wish Jon and Kate the very best, but particularly the ones that I am worried about are those eight kids."
List, who only offered his services to Gosselin due to a close friendship with Jon's late father, says he has "no hard feelings against Jon."
"Would I have preferred it being done differently? Sure. Because it wasn't just a professional relationship, it was a personal relationship that went back from when he was 18 years old."
You know what this means: From now on, when Jon's accused of being completely "incoherent," he has no one to blame but himself.
—Reporting by Claudia Rosenbaum
.
Read more: http://www.eonline.com/uberblog/b177598_jon_gosselin_really_truly_ready_make.html#ixzz0lrd1EY2m
Attorney List has a very impressive resume.
Something to keep in mind: an attorney does not go far in the judicial system by being unethical.
Jon is a liar.
JMO.
Smells like TLC to me....
Just Another Girl
This is total BS - Kart's plane did not land until early this morning -oops-TLC Kart has not written one word of these blog postings -- more propaganda and very poorly done at that.
Jacket-snacking
04/22/2010
Recently, a little Gosselin told me that certain ones of mine are boarding the school bus in the morning, with book bags and lunch boxes in hand -- just as they should be. The bus driver smiles and greets each one, and in return my children do the same. So polite. So proper.
But, as the bus begins to move, I'm told, certain children who belong to me, raise their jackets over their heads as if they are pitching a tent. (Good for them. We all know that I CAN'T -- not very timely anyway!) Then they do the unthinkable: They RAID their freshly packed lunches!
SO, what's a mom to do?
I resisted the urge to get angry but wondered why a half-hour after eating a HUGE bowl of warm oatmeal and a half of a banana for breakfast they would feel the need to do this. Was it because they couldn't resist the special home-baked dessert in their lunches? Was it curiosity as to what was inside? Or could they really be HUNGRY?
If the reason was the latter, I needed to do something fast! I can’t have my babies riding away in the big yellow school bus with hungry bellies! So last night, I spent an exciting evening with piles of Ziploc snack bags surrounding me and various boxes of “healthy” cookies like cinnamon graham crackers and oatmeal cookies. (C'mon moms, on school mornings we can all exaggerate the nutritional benefit of certain breakfast foods chosen out of pure desperation, can we not?)
Then I called a meeting, in which I was the only non-5-year-old present, and explained that there would be no more jacket-snacking. I went on to explain the solution carefully: From now on, in the outside pocket of each lunch box, I would place an additional approved breakfast bus snack that they were allowed to eat out in the open for all to see.
I can't wait to start receiving calls from the bus driver asking me to sweep the bus floor each afternoon as my kids file off the bus. Think I'll make a note to put a broom and dust pan in our big blue bus awhile -- just in case …
~Kate
Once again, Jon is abusing the goodwill of a family friend. Out of deference to Jon's deceased father, I don't think List will sue him. He made a statement to E online and said while he's shocked at Jon's actions, he won't harbor ill feelings towards him, but he is still concerned about the eight.
http://www.eonline.com/uberblog/b177598_jon_gosselin_really_truly_ready_make.html
I agree that Jon needs to stand up for his kids. It's his job. He is failing at that right now and either 1. TLC has paid him off, which would make him despicable or 2. TLC has something over him that would threaten his parental rights. Maybe he (purely speculation) he does have a drug problem and TLC has proof and is holding it over him.
Either way, I wish there was SOME way to take on TLC. Could we hire Mr. List (pro bono, Mr List?) to go after TLC? (I realize my question is naive at best but I HATE that we have so much proof that TLC has destroyed this family and there's nothing we can do about it). Erin Brockovich?
TMZ and E are reporting conflicting stories regarding Kate coming home. TMZ makes it sound like she was arriving in NYC with the kids and E is reporting she left the kids at home to GO to NYC. I think maybe she came back with the kids and flew into NYC, dropped them off at home and then took off again? IDK, confusing!
I think the CHILDREN should hire Mr. List. Other than Kevin and Jodi, he seems to be the only one that comments on how he worries about them.
Isn't Kate supposed to be in NYC tomorrow for Regis and Kelly?
If so, Kate would drop off kids and leave shortly thereafter.
Jon is not scared of TLC.They are scared of him. That's why every time he attempts to do something in the children's best interests, they throw money at him.They must be trying to conceal something very big.Perhaps it will be uncovered in Rep.Murt's investigation ; I certainly hope so.I wonder if Attorney List was given the whole picture by Jon or if he is unaware of the possible repercussions to TLC, of bringing this suit forward.We will never know, as he is an ethical man who will protect Lawyer-Client confidentiality.In the meantime all we can do is engage in informed speculation.
NancyB
Oh for god's sake. What utter (or should I say, UDDER) crap this is. Home baked dessert? Uh huh. Right...... Maybe home baked by the chef.
Total sheeple food. Baaaaaaa
The children and Kate are wearing the same clothing in the NY airport as they are at home. It looks to me like the airport pictures were taken on their way home from CA.
The sad thing (apart from the obvious) is that Jon screwed his late father's friend. What a self-involved, self-pitying ass he is. Hmmmm...reminds me of someone else I loathe.
mommyinca - I believe Kate and kids flew into NYC airport today (Kate and kids wearing same clothes in both photos, Kate and kids went to the McMansion, Kate repacked and left to go to the airport and back to NYC for Regis show.
Jon is at the house...see pictures
http://www.hollywoodlife.com/2010/04/22/hey-kate-you-just-got-home-now-youre-leaving-again-your-kids-miss-you-so-much/
I agree my9cats - I do not know how either of them look themselves in the mirror.
Jon's lawyer wasn't all that impressive anyways. He was chomping on some gum and was clueless about the Gosselin drama that was going on for the past 3+ years.
He should have gotten up to speed with all the drama, gossip, etc etc. Before ever deciding to make an appearance on a national TV show where he will be defending someone like Jon.
Also, chomping on the gum while being interviewed wasn't very professional.
The fact that the court document he filed contained "errors" and didn't list Jon's address was also foolish.
Jon cannot seem to find one good attorney. He has had bad representation since day 1. And the fact that he is a total idiot doesn't help his case.
Jon has settled wit TLC. So everything that has been going on since then, wass probably a PR stunt orchestrated by TLC...
The timing of Jon petition for primary custody, on par with Kate being on DWTS. Then Jon claiming he didn't want primary custody after Kate was booted?
To the fact that Kate didn't seem to 'worry' about the court filing. Seems like we have all be taken for a ride.
Anonymouse,
I totally agree about the gum. However, List responded and said he didn't note Jon's address because the document was going to be public and he didn't want Jon's address made public. Not sure why not since everyone knows where the kids live.
I'm not an advocate of the extreme amount of litigation that goes on in our country, but is it possible for Jon's lawyer to sue Jon for making false statements and destroying his credibility, etc, as an attorney? cause if so, I think he should.
sigh.
Is there any legal cause for the kids to get a guardian ad litem and does anyone have any standing to ask that one be appointed? (all my legal knowledge comes from David E Kelley shows, so I don't know. the only thing I'm clear on is what the 4th amendment is. that was always a big deal in his shows)
In 2009, when he took the kids off TV, Jon stated that TLC "is afraid of what I'll say, because they are afraid of the truth."This was when he was talking about how the show was bad for the kids. I think he was right, as TLC is going to any lengths to see that evidence of any alleged wrongdoing on their part is being swept under the rug.I don't believe WE were being played by Jon, I think TLC and Mr.List were.There is an ugly word that describes the act of demanding money to keep one's mouth shut.
It was never proven that Mr. List is, in fact, a friend of the late Dr. Gosselin. That was planted by someone and everyone assumed it to be true.
Not sure why not since everyone knows where the kids live.
SG, I believe at the time Jon was living with his brother and they didn't want a swarm of reporters invading his brother's home.
In comments today, Mr. List said he has known Jon since he was 18 years old. I think it's safe to assume he might have known him through his dad.
If List said he knew Jon since he was 18, that why didn't he represent Jon in the very beginning?
List was probably in on this charade.
iatk,
Yes, I know. What I meant was that the children's safety should be what is important... everyone knows where they live and the paps wait outside to take pics... but they make sure to not mention where Jon is staying.
Oh, gotcha now SG. I'm guessing Mr. List didn't represent Jon until he was asked. I really don't think List was in on it. By all accounts he has an excellent reputation. He's a criminal lawyer. Why would he throw it away on a civil case that's somewhat trivial in the larger scope of things.
To be fair, we don't know if List contacted Jon or not when J&K announced their divorce. Maybe he did, maybe Jon said he already had a lawyer. Who knows? So now List is a bad guy, too and "in on" everything? When do the conspiracy theories stop?
Now, Mr. List said he didn't know anything about being fired until the tweets today by Jon, so something sounds fishy there to me. I don't think List is lying, but somethings not right.
IDModo~
I have to say that you're making a very interesting and convincing argument, at least to me. But do you think Jon is smart enough to be pulling this off?
I'm having a bit of difficulty seeing Jon as that clever...but you are swaying me here, I have to admit. ;)
And if I'm following you correctly...couldn't Jon be held accountable eventually if something that directly affected the children had not been reported to the proper authorities by him? But that he chose to use the word that begins with "ex" against TLC? I'm assuming this is in the general ballpark that you're thinking of.
itsaboutthekids said...
Now, Mr. List said he didn't know anything about being fired until the tweets today by Jon, so something sounds fishy there to me. I don't think List is lying, but somethings not right.
____________________________________
Not only did Jon supposedly tweet, but TMZ has him on videotape saying the same thing. Jon says he sent list a letter of April 15th. Something definitely stinks.
Maybe when Jon tweeted that he is no longer represented by List, he looked at the calendar and looked at the wrong Thursday - 15th instead of the 22nd?
Typically you're supposed to fill out a subsitition of attorney form and file it with the court if there is ongoing litigation. If you want to fire someone you put yourself as in pro per. If you want to sub them with someone else you put the new person's name in. List is still his attorney until that's filed.
Jon says, on the TMZ video, that he "filed a termination letter" on April 15. He said, "That's all I need."
Yet List says this is the first he's heard.
Ummm,
Kate's BS Blog entry --- perhaps if she fed them enough at breakfast they could make it at least to school without needing a snack. Her entries have said "half a banana" and "ONE pickle on the plate" - will she still be portioning their foods for them when they're teenagers?
Dee3,
Check the end of the previous thread for a reply from me.
I read the latest story on ROL, quoting List. He truly seems to have Jon's interests at heart and is taking his professional responsibilities seriously. It would be unethical for Kate's attorneys to deal directly with Jon until the Court allows List to withdraw or there is a formal substitution of attorneys. As the Admin said, just because a client says he is firing his lawyer doesn't mean the lawyer can just throw up his hands and walk away. List knows what we all do -- that without a lawyer, Jon will get crushed, again.
As one who has lived a lot of life's experiences, It seems to me that we are "throwing Jon under the bus" without knowing all the facts. In my experience, large corporations, such as TLC, can and do control people through any means. We have seen that since Jon settled with them--we don't see him talking to anyone any more.
I believe Jon is more than a puppet to TLC. I think he fears them--he has been threatened in some way--perhaps they will gather their big "guns" and make sure he never sees his kids again--we don't know what it is, but trust me, it is something. They have complete control over him. I believe that there could have been veiled threats against his life. (not impossible with a company as 'hell-bent' and control as TLC)
I do not put it past TLC to charge him with false accusations to take his kids away. We have to give him credit for speaking out for so long, filing a lawsuit...and untimately being shut down by some TLC threat. I'm glad he is in the childrens' lives--without his loving ways with them, what would happen to them.
He has successfully been kept from TV interviews, yet Kate can give them constantly--What gives there?? Jon proved to be a problem with his ready friendliness to all reporters, and they have somehow, in some evil way, shut him down!!
Does anyone think that Kate looks drugged in a lot of recent pictures?? I suspect that she keeps going with meds and alcohol. At times I feel sorry for her, as she is her worst enemy. She is truly all alone, by her own choice.
Her dancing with the stars was so pitiful. To keep it up, with people laughing and making fun of her, made me sad for her--that she would subject herself to such folly. Someone higher than her made a total buffoon out of her!
As we all agree, the darling kids are the losers in this situation. I am not thrilled with Jon, but in looking back at the early pictures, he truly has been a hands on Dad to these kids, working tirelessly with them in the early days. I tell myself that all of that loving had to do something for their development which they will carry through life.
We need to hope and pray that something or someone will call a halt to this foolishness and these children will get the home they deserve eventually. I wish the state would step in and examine the situation, but unfortunately weath and status plays into the whole situation.
I believe that the children have been physically and mentally abused by their mother and someone was very remiss in not reporting it!
mommyinca said...
I agree that Jon needs to stand up for his kids. It's his job. He is failing at that right now and either 1. TLC has paid him off, which would make him despicable or 2. TLC has something over him that would threaten his parental rights. Maybe he (purely speculation) he does have a drug problem and TLC has proof and is holding it over him.
Either way, I wish there was SOME way to take on TLC.
It's also possible that Jon is doing a crappy job protecting his children and that TLC has nothing to do with it. I don't care one iota about his divorce settlement or whether TLC played a part in it. I do care about the innocent children affected by TLC's long reach into their lives. As Admin said: I am out of excuses for Jon. He is their father. TLC is not their parent. Steve is not their parent. DWTS is not their parent. He is their parent. He and Kate. They control the kids, period. Only they're letting TLC do it. What is he so scared of? TLC might take everything away? Big whoop he doesn't work anyway. He could start over, he's basically had to anyway. He's had so many good attorneys offer to help him including Paul Peterson and List. I absolutely think he could have won his lawsuit, easily. He has NO EXCUSE not to be a man and a father right now and end this.
Enough said. Amen, Admin., and thank you.
IDModo said...
Jon is not scared of TLC.They are scared of him. That's why every time he attempts to do something in the children's best interests, they throw money at him.
What money? All I've heard he's gotten is $5000/month which was the old contract amount. When I think of money and the Gosselins in the same context I think of TLC's big money and it's influence on the family and their income because of the show, but Jon's been out of that picture since last year. What did I miss or are we talking about the same thing?
Admin,
Re: You may want to look at the 3:58 pm post.
Dee3- Perhaps Jon isn't that bright but look at the sleazy friends he has managed to amass since his marriage broke up.I can see one of them suggesting to Jon that a few well-placed words to TLC would put him in good financial shape and be able to pay child support, as well as pay for his day-to-day living expenses. He will need to have some money to pay for his new apartment in Reading.He may just think it's a way to get what's rightfully his.Jon is a very suggestible man, his opinions are usually those of the last person he talked to.
Of course he could, and should, be held accountable for not reporting things that directly affected the children. But he has a lot less to lose than TLC.They could lose their license and be sued for millions.And he may believe that as long as he remains silent, he is safe.
http://www.radaronline.com/exclusives/2010/04/exclusive-interview-jons-gosselins-legal-limbo-attorney-doesnt-know-if-he-still
EXCLUSIVE INTERVIEW: Jon Gosselin's Legal Limbo; Attorney Doesn't Know If He Is Still Representing The Father-Of-Eight
Posted on Apr 22, 2010 @ 02:50PM
Despite Jon Gosselin’s Tweets that he’s fired divorce attorney Anthony List for making disparaging statements about ex-wife Kate, in a bizarre twist, List tells RadarOnline.com he is still on the case.
Gosselin released a statement today saying that he’s terminated List. "Mr. Anthony List Sr., Esq. is not my representing attorney; I terminated him on April 15, 2010,” he Tweeted.
Jon Gosselin Fires Divorce Attorney
The former Jon & Kate Plus 8 star was reportedly angry that List had announced that he was moving forward with an ‘absentee mom’ argument against Kate Gosselin regarding custody of their children.
But despite the apparent confusion List claims that he has Jon’s best interests at heart and only wants to protect Gosselin until he has new legal representation officially in place.
He told RadarOnline.com: “Look, I contacted the clerk at Berks County Court yesterday and my name was still on the file.
PHOTOS: Kate's Home And Gone
“As an officer of the court I need to protect my client and I don’t want Jon to be left in grave prejudice – I don’t want to see him hurt.”
“I just want a lawyer’s letter, and for the court to tell me they have an ‘entry of appearance’ so that everybody can breathe easy.
“This is really important because these are the most serious negotiations of Jon Gosselin’s life and he needs to protect himself and the rights of his children too.
“There is another status conference scheduled for May 7, 2010, before Judge Timothy Rawley at Berks County Court and at present I am still scheduled to represent Jon at this time.
“Due to attorney and client privilege I cannot reveal specifics about what Jon and I discussed in private regarding his kids. Obviously, he wants an input about where and when he gets to see his kids and that is a big concern to him.”
Kate’s Lawyer Mark Momjian told RadarOnline.com earlier today: “We want to encourage dialogue between the parties in the hope that all issues are resolved amicably - that makes sense for the parents and more importantly for the Gosselin children."
Every move Jon has made has been for Jon. If it ever looked like it was for the children those that wanted to see it that way did. Its really dumb to act all confused now.
Trust me, Jon's got nothing on TLC. More like the other way around.
bbsak-He was given $25,000 per month in order to pay Kate the $21,000 child support.I read that this amount was kept in an escrow account and doled out to Kate every month.I also believe we don't know the full extent of Jon's financial dealings with TLC, only what the media has been able to report.
I'm ALWAYS skeptical when someone says, 'trust me'. If you know something concrete you must have something that verifies your 'trust me' statement. Would you care to share?
I thought we were a group of bloggers who tried to quash rumor and wild theories and searched for the facts. Reading some of the comments it feels like we're going off the deep end looking for conspiracy theories and hit-men, etc. I can only imagine what our detractors are saying about us (because I care about this blog's credibility).
I'm taking a break and apologizing if my statement was abrupt.
bbsak~
I had read conflicting stories of what amount Jon receives monthly from TLC. I'd read $5000 and I'd also read $25,000. Is there verification anywhere of how much they pay him monthly per the contract, do you know?
IDModo,
I was under the impression they escrowed Jon's divorce settlement to cover his support payments, but I honestly am not sure at this time.
I think Jon is acting out of fear and greed and that List is trying to protect him from himself.
(on this board my name is Kath, so I didn't post the comment that that a poster Kathy did. I think I'll go by Kath101 from now on)
Jon doesn't get any kind of a pass from me, not this time.
I also read somewhere that Jon was getting $25,000 from TLC and $21,700 (I believe this number was from Mr. List) was being escrowed for child support. But that doesn't add up to the $5,000 that Jon is supposedly receiving. There's been so many number thrown around from various media outlets.
Look at all Jon's past behavior. He has been offered help from Paul Peterson, Gloria Alred, and now List, a friend of his fathers. He doesn't want it. He could go to the state of PA. if there was any form of child abuse.
Jon wants to co-host a show.
I'm no fan of Kate's but they are in this together. When it all falls in place don't be surprised.
List said on Nancy Grace that Jon was getting $5000 a month from TLC and Kate was getting $100,000 a month.
How sad the kids have to hide and sneak food. Normal, well-fed children don't do this. We have seen the tiny portions Kate doles out for dinner, so I'm not surprised they are ravenous in the morning.
Give them the entire banana mommie dearest.
bbsak,
I agree that even though speculation and opinion has it's place and will always be a part of a blog, we should stick to the facts as much as possible and try to find the proof to support those opinions. Asking questions is always good and there are certainly enough of those. Finding the answers...not so easy.
Gosh, I'm getting myself a little confused jumping back and forth between topics.
bbsak~
I definitely was not referring to anyone breaking anyone else's bones or anything like that. It's just that even before these latest events involving Jon firing his lawyer, I've been SO flummoxed about why in the world a huge corporation would go to such extreme lengths to promote and protect this one woman...a woman who, although a controversial celebrity right at this moment, has no real talent to speak of...in terms of being any sort of long-term valuable investment.
This situation is SO over-the-top, that any sane-thinking person would be highly suspicious that something doesn't seem right....and clearly, we all seem to be suspicious, to one degree or another.
And I have become, at this point, SO highly suspicious of and distrustful of TLC...that any time an event happens that just adds more questions (like these recent events), I just feel more and more confused about what is REALLY going on and also become more and more convinced that TLC is behind it in one way or another.
And I've become uncomfortable even making assumptions about any of the main players in this debacle because there are so few real facts available and because I always feel that TLC is very involved in engineering so much of it behind the scenes.
So I try to do my best to reason it out...but with this latest Jon stuff....it doesn't even make any sense to me. And it's making less and less sense to me the more I think about it. At this point, I don't even KNOW if I know enough to even blame the whole thing on Jon. I don't know what to think, actually.
Someone here wrote something along the lines of...if Steve and TLC have helped to get Kate to work out an amicable custody agreement, Jon doesn't need a lawyer. But to me, you should ALWAYS take a lawyer to court with you. Nothing makes sense to me.
There is no need for Jon to have a lawyer. They will not go to court. Kate's Lawyer will file some paper work with the court in Kate and Jon's behave.
Well, I have to agree with that, dee3. You should ALWAYS have a lawyer when dealing with law related issues. You certainly wouldn't check yourself into a hospital and perform your own surgery.
I disagree, jon's for jon. Even if they don't go to court you need a lawyer looking over your shoulder to make sure you're getting proper representation.
nancyb, that blog entry is priceless. I thought the kids ate 20 boxes of cereal, 8 dozen eggs, and bacon for breakfast? Now it's a HUGE bowl of oatmeal and half a banana? How wonderful that she makes it all about herself with an allusion to home baked goods. And I laughed when she talks about sweeping up the bus. She'd send someone else to do it. She wouldn't stoop so low. But, she could put the dustpan in there anyway - I'm sure the big wooden spoon would appreciate the company.
Claire, those pap pics (TMZ) say the family was flying into Maryland, not NYC. They were coming home from CA. She flew to NYC solo. Again. Sad that her kids had to endure 2 cross-country flights to be in the same place as their mother. I would say 'see' their mother but I doubt much of that occurred at all.
ESPECIALLY when it involves highly emotional issues like the custody/visitation of your children. JMO
Its only highly emotional to you outsiders. It was never that way for Jon and Kate.
Whether it's emotional for them or not, it's always wiser to have an attorney guide you through the legal questions and your rights than to wing it on your own. Even attorneys hire other attorneys for their personal cases.
List didn't say he contacted the clerk to see if he was still on the case. Only that he "contacted the clerk at Berks County Court yesterday and my name was still on the file." He could have been contacting them for any number of reasons--to get the next court date, to ask about due dates, to file something. If you're not on the case, the clerk would say you've been substituted out I can no longer give you information on this case. He's saying as of yesterday no one told me I wasn't on the case--I think that's what he meant.
He is doing exactly what I would do. Until the Court relieves you with a proper substiution of attorney, you are still the attorney and you're still suppsoed to act as the attorney.
I can't tell you how many clients cry wolf about firing their attorneys. The attorney is always the first person to blame when something goes wrong. Just because someone is boo-hooing doesn't meant you get to throw in the towel. I have also had clients disappear on me fail to contact me, but I still have to stay on the case until I am able to get relieved by the judge.
When I wrote "major players", I did not mean Kate. To me, Kate is always predictable. I understand NPD fairly well and I'm never confused by what Kate does...or why.
But when it comes to Jon...I'm never sure what's going on and why. I have no idea what the specifics are in his contract with TLC. I have no idea what they can hold over him or threaten him with or threaten to take away, etc.
All I do know is that they are going to a HELL of a lot of trouble for someone and I'm not entirely sure why.
I feel more confident in my assessments when it involves Kate....but with Jon, I rarely do. I don't have nearly enough facts (in fact, I have hardly any facts) to assess why Jon does the things he does. I do feel that Jon is passive-aggressive but beyond that, I have no idea. I often feel like strangling him myself, but when it comes right down to it, I never feel entirely certain why he does what he does. I'm not completely sure if it's all about money when it comes to Jon...but then I'm also not completely sure that it's not. When it comes to him, I just don't know what to think.
I'm seriously disgusted with this latest firing of his attorney....but why he's doing this, I really have no clue.
That's true itsabout, But is was never that way. It was only presented to the public like that. They have their own agenda.
Admin -
In the original court papers, the Scheduling Order contained the following statement:
NOTE: ALL PARTIES ARE REQUIRED TO ATTEND THE PROGRAM WHETHER OR NOT AN AGREEMENT IS SUBMITTED.
(PROGRAM is referring to Children in the Middle/Parenting Class)
Would this still be applicable if the case were settled out of court? I'm a little confused because of the wording "whether or not an agreement is submitted."
I'm sure they do have their own agenda and we can speculate what that is based on their past actions and comments, but we can't really KNOW until we see the results.
Kate is all over the map and so is Jon. One day Kate wants to be a star and the next day she's crying because she HAS to work and can't be home baking cookies. One day Jon wants more time with the kids (which I happen to believe he does) but the next day he's chatting it up with Kate's lawyer and firing his own.
None of this makes much sense and I'm beginning to think there's not one brain between them, especially when it comes to the kids.
dee3 said: "In other words, I can't go all out and 100% blame him until I can know for sure that TLC did not cause a situation for him that made it literally impossible for him to do otherwise. And I say this because my suspicions and loathing for TLC is so great, that I would not put ANYTHING past them."
I agree, dee3. I also agree with the earlier poster who said that there is a reason why tlc didn't want the custody case to go to trial if the kids would be talking to anyone "unsanctioned" by them. Something is too weird here.
Maybe Kate gave Jon permission to stay in the house while she's away in NYC this weekend if he fires his attorney poste haste.
On the other hand, Jon, the dim bulb that he is, figured he'd fire his attorney on TMZ.com and he'd be back in Kate's good graces. Jon saying he terminated his attorney on TMZ.Com is more than he's said to any tabloid since his TLC settlement.
It's a PR move, a publicity stunt and it keeps the Gosselins in the news still. After all, Kate is off DWTS, there's no interest in her book signings as evidenced by the one in Santa Monica last week and this keeps the Bonnie and Clyde duo from Wernersville, still in the news.
With that said, Kate claims to have had the kids with her last week for 6 days. That was on Saturday. This week, they all arrive in the airport in Baltimore, (NOT NYC as was reported by TMZ and ROL). That's another five days. So adding it all up, have the kids missed two weeks of school?
Its playing out just like they wanted it too. It makes for good tabloid, keeping everyone wondering, guessing, most importantly focused and talking about them.
Monday, I will be in Lancaster PA for business. I intend to stop by the court house and take a look at the court filing from Jon. I'd do it tomorrow but after today's episode with the biopsy, I'm taking it easy tomorrow. The filing is public record, hasn't been sealed and if there is something in there, other than what was reported by TMZ and ROL, I'll let you know.
If the fact that the kids have been taken out of school for 2 weeks for a PR move by mommy dearest, isn't this something Rep Murt needs to question? Has anyone sent him this information?
Kelly,
You can see the papers Mr. List filed on Jon's bahalf @ custody and support here:
http://tmz.vo.llnwd.net/o28/newsdesk/tmz_documents/0407_gosselin_TMZ.pdf
LancasterCountyMom~
Thank you so much and hugs to you. I feel so confused right now. :(
Please make me laugh, somebody.
Maybe we can list all the conspiracy theories:
1. Jon and Kate are in this together and the laugh's on us.
2. In fact, the whole thing's been scripted from the get-go and the laugh's on us.
3. Even Attorney List is in on it and he's even laughing at us.
4. TLC is threatening to send a hit man after Jon if he doesn't do everything they say.
5. Jon was ordered to pay a quarter of a million dollars a year in child support because he got multi-millions in the property settlement.
6. Which means that Kate has to be a multi-multi-millionaire.
7. TLC is paying Jon's child support for him.
8. Jon is a drug addict but for some unknown reason, Hailey hasn't included that in her tweets about him.
9. TLC promised Jon his own talk show on TV if he fired his lawyer.
10. TLC is the ruler of the entire world.
11. This is just a nightmare and I'm gonna wake up tomorrow.
Any others?
Bbsak,
Thanks for the link. I think there have been other papers added to that, including those from Kate's attorney and answers from Jon's attorney that haven't been published. Someone from TMZ or ROL, save me the time and publish the additions. It's not that I am going out of my way to read them. I'll be in the area for business. I'm not that infatuated with Jon and Kate to make a trip to PA to learn anything about them.
Kelly,
You're right, there have been responses (Kate's motion to dismiss and Jon's reply, plus I don't know what all else) and pleas filed by both sides, but I guess ROL was too busy concentrating on doing dance show PR and didn't bother to post them. Hurry right home on Monday.
I hope you bounce back quickly after the procedure today and that the results are clear. We're thinking about you and wishing you the best.
Hi, dee3
I don't know that I can cheer you up, but one thing I do know that might help is, I don't think Jon and Kate can play this game forever or even for very much longer. It's all about ratings = money and TLC might be able to get them on the air, but they can't make us watch. I'd say a public shunning of any and all Gosselin related shows is in order.
And Jon nor Kate nor TLC can keep the kids from getting older. And the older they get the more they're going to rebel because that's just what kids do even under normal circumstances. They develop a mind of their own and they test their world.
Itsaboutthekids, sadly I don't think Aaden is gonna rebel for some reason. He looks so dejected in that photo.
I've been reading the blogs most of the day, but HAD to get food in the house, and when I come back, the kids have been out of school for 2 weeks? Where'd that come from? Help!!
Hi Claire,
They might not all rebel, but out of eight, some will and hopefully they will be the protectors of the others. I see that in Mady already and it's good to see her determination. Sometimes it's the quiet ones that make the biggest impact in later years. We'll just have to wait and see. :)
Kelly,
there are papers filed at the Lancaster County Courthouse on the Gosselins?
TLC is the ruler of the entire world.
dee3...it's starting to look that way... :/
itsaboutthekids, yes I did notice in the picture of Kate with kids at the airport, that Mady had her hand on Aaden's back and seemed to be talking to/comforting him. She's suffered a bad rap through this whole nightmare, probably because she saw what it sham it all was, and didn't play along. I hope she'll survive all the negativity and come out of this ok, as I hope they all will.
ALL of Jon's problems are boiled down to one fact. He is the father of 8 very small children and DOES NOT WANT TO WORK. That is why Jon & his kids (who he can't support) are hostage to TLC. Jon is lazily and he stated that when he met Kate he had no job plans whatsoever.
When was the last time Jon held a regular (normal) 8 hours job where he reported to work? Wasn't it when the governor of PA felt sorry for him and created a position for him at his office. That was when the sextuplets were around 1 and then he quit when they were probably around 3. He was even unemployed for many months when Kate was pregnant with the sextuplets and when they were born.
Think about it. He is the father of 8 kids and the little ones are turning 6 years old. He doesn't have a career at all and I think his job description of IT analyst, IT engineer is totally blown up. Does anyone know what Jon's training/education consisted of to work in the IT field. I might be wrong, but I assume it was probaby less than 6 months training and therefore he is by no means an engineer or analyst.
But now would be the perfect time for Jon to enroll in college and get at least a 2 year associate degree and if not a 4 year degree. He has the money to do it and the time. Most college course are long distance meaning you don't have to literally go the college everyday in sit in class. It would give him direction, pride, and a degree. Meanwhile he needs to stay 100% out of the media. Everytime he is in the media he gets creamed. He is absolute toast in the public's mind. The only way to correct this is to either enroll full-time in college or get a job working 40 hours. He can still be a great parent and do this. How embarrassing for his kids when they are asked, "what does your Dad do"? The public and soon his kids will never respect him if he is not employed. And so what if he only makes 30 or 40 thousand dollars a year. That is what the great majority of Americans make at his age.
I want to defend Jon, I really do--but he is stupid if he fired his lawyer now. Either he is completely clueless or the whole thing was a PR stunt to generate "interest" in her book (and to boost magazine sales?).
This is "deja vu all over again." Last year, when the divorce proceedings were first started, Jon said he and Kate were trying to work things out "privately and amicably." Look how well that turned out, Jon.
When Jon seemed to want out of the show after season 4--all of a sudden he signed onto season 5 (it was rumored he was bribed with a motorcyle and promises that he could do what he wanted, as long as he showed up for filming and kept up the farce). Well, that blew up in his face, too.
He even mentioned last year that perhaps "somebody" would give him a job in TV as a host, etc. Yep, Jon THAT happened, too--(snark).
And now, Jon appears to be playing nice with Kate and TLC in order to get some kind of a deal--it's the same sh*t, different day.
"Quid pro quo." Jon will sign a new contract with a development deal (not that he will ever get anything that will last) and get some money. TLC, in return, gets to keep a leash on Jon and resume some filming of the children.
I am sick of both Jon and Kate. I do feel for the kids, though--I'm sure they love their parents and would like a more normal life--but it doesn't seem as if that will happen anytime soon.
What papers were filed at the Lancaster County Courthouse? The only ones I'm aware of are the municipal tax lien and Discovery Talent Services vs. Jon (subpoena -- Stephanie).
Kelly,
If you want to check on the custody papers, you need to go to the Berks County Courthouse where they were filed, not the Lancaster County Courthouse.
Or are there other papers for which you are searching?
If there's anything at the Lancaster one, I could check sometime...today I was about a block away from there. :)
"If there's anything at the Lancaster one, I could check sometime...today I was about a block away from there. :)"
Ditto. But why fight the parking, especially on a Friday! ;-) Everything is online (or at least it used to be) on the Prothonotary webpage. It's all public record.
"It's a PR move, a publicity stunt and it keeps the Gosselins in the news still."
Then why drop the custody fight? It would generate MORE publicity if it's on-going, what with bloggers with inquiring minds wanting to know all the nitty-gritty details. Now that it's dropped, it's over. No more speculation as to which party is going to get custody.
Could it be that Jon knows that Khate is having an affair with a very high up exec (think top¬male) at TLC and has the evidence?
You're around here, too, Midnight? Cool :)
Everything is online? Double cool! :D
...............................
Midnight Serenade said: "Ditto. But why fight the parking, especially on a Friday! ;-) Everything is online (or at least it used to be) on the Prothonotary webpage. It's all public record."
You're around here, too, Midnight? Cool :)
Everything is online? Double cool! :D
...............................
Midnight Serenade said: "Ditto. But why fight the parking, especially on a Friday! ;-) Everything is online (or at least it used to be) on the Prothonotary webpage. It's all public record."
"It's a PR move, a publicity stunt and it keeps the Gosselins in the news still."
Then why drop the custody fight? It would generate MORE publicity if it's on-going, what with bloggers with inquiring minds wanting to know all the nitty-gritty details. Now that it's dropped, it's over. No more speculation as to which party is going to get custody.
Kelly,
If you want to check on the custody papers, you need to go to the Berks County Courthouse where they were filed, not the Lancaster County Courthouse.
Or are there other papers for which you are searching?
What papers were filed at the Lancaster County Courthouse? The only ones I'm aware of are the municipal tax lien and Discovery Talent Services vs. Jon (subpoena -- Stephanie).
I want to defend Jon, I really do--but he is stupid if he fired his lawyer now. Either he is completely clueless or the whole thing was a PR stunt to generate "interest" in her book (and to boost magazine sales?).
This is "deja vu all over again." Last year, when the divorce proceedings were first started, Jon said he and Kate were trying to work things out "privately and amicably." Look how well that turned out, Jon.
When Jon seemed to want out of the show after season 4--all of a sudden he signed onto season 5 (it was rumored he was bribed with a motorcyle and promises that he could do what he wanted, as long as he showed up for filming and kept up the farce). Well, that blew up in his face, too.
He even mentioned last year that perhaps "somebody" would give him a job in TV as a host, etc. Yep, Jon THAT happened, too--(snark).
And now, Jon appears to be playing nice with Kate and TLC in order to get some kind of a deal--it's the same sh*t, different day.
"Quid pro quo." Jon will sign a new contract with a development deal (not that he will ever get anything that will last) and get some money. TLC, in return, gets to keep a leash on Jon and resume some filming of the children.
I am sick of both Jon and Kate. I do feel for the kids, though--I'm sure they love their parents and would like a more normal life--but it doesn't seem as if that will happen anytime soon.
Jon's lawyer wasn't all that impressive anyways. He was chomping on some gum and was clueless about the Gosselin drama that was going on for the past 3+ years.
He should have gotten up to speed with all the drama, gossip, etc etc. Before ever deciding to make an appearance on a national TV show where he will be defending someone like Jon.
Also, chomping on the gum while being interviewed wasn't very professional.
The fact that the court document he filed contained "errors" and didn't list Jon's address was also foolish.
Jon cannot seem to find one good attorney. He has had bad representation since day 1. And the fact that he is a total idiot doesn't help his case.
Jon has settled wit TLC. So everything that has been going on since then, wass probably a PR stunt orchestrated by TLC...
The timing of Jon petition for primary custody, on par with Kate being on DWTS. Then Jon claiming he didn't want primary custody after Kate was booted?
To the fact that Kate didn't seem to 'worry' about the court filing. Seems like we have all be taken for a ride.
If the fact that the kids have been taken out of school for 2 weeks for a PR move by mommy dearest, isn't this something Rep Murt needs to question? Has anyone sent him this information?
Attorney List has a very impressive resume.
Something to keep in mind: an attorney does not go far in the judicial system by being unethical.
Jon is a liar.
JMO.
Besides the obvious, what especially bothers me is that Jon screwed his late fathers friend.
KON were made for each other. Now go away and STFU!
Admin., do you think Mr. List will just remain silent on this, or will he need to provide some sort of reponse concerning the implied allegations of misconduct. I guess what I'm asking is, what would YOU do in this situation?
I am out of excuses for Jon. He is their father. TLC is not their parent. Steve is not their parent. DWTS is not their parent. He is their parent. He and Kate. They control the kids, period. Only they're letting TLC do it. What is he so scared of? TLC might take everything away? Big whoop he doesn't work anyway. He could start over, he's basically had to anyway. He's had so many good attorneys offer to help him including Paul Peterson and List. I absolutely think he could have won his lawsuit, easily. He has NO EXCUSE not to be a man and a father right now and end this.
I don't know why he is so scared of these people. I went up and faced Kate and got pulled away by Mr. Rat Claw, I survived it. They're just stupid D-listers, they're not the FBI.
Jon will probably say that the had "discussed" filing for primary custody; but he didn't agree to go forward with it or something like that.
What I don't understand is how he vehemently didn't want the kids filmed anymore, and put a stop to that.
Now, if she is having another series with the kids....doesn't he care anymore?
Oh, that's right, it was a ploy at the time and now he realizes that lots of money can be made by having them back on TV.
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