Jon's pleas with the court that filming should stop because the children have experienced "negative effects" and are "struggling with emotional and/or behavior issues" fall on deaf ears.Jon went on to say, "I will have to answer to my children for the rest of my life. I will have to live with this guilt the rest of my life. I am truly sorry."
To Jon, do not feel guilty about trying to fix what you clearly and rightly recognize as a mistake. It's never too late. And keep on fighting for what you know in your heart is best for your children.
In family law cases when parents share legal custody, as Jon and Kate do, when there is a dispute such as there is here over filming, the parents must go to family law court to have a judge resolve it. We can only hope the judge tried to do the best thing given the facts he or she was presented with. But at this point, we'd really like to see the children represented by a children's attorney with extensive experience representing minors in family law court. A lot of adults are telling us how they feel, but a court has yet to hear from the children themselves. We have one question for the judge, however: Why should a child have to give up their privacy to support their parents?
In family law cases when parents share legal custody, as Jon and Kate do, when there is a dispute such as there is here over filming, the parents must go to family law court to have a judge resolve it. We can only hope the judge tried to do the best thing given the facts he or she was presented with. But at this point, we'd really like to see the children represented by a children's attorney with extensive experience representing minors in family law court. A lot of adults are telling us how they feel, but a court has yet to hear from the children themselves. We have one question for the judge, however: Why should a child have to give up their privacy to support their parents?
Jon's Statement:
On Friday 15th October 2010, @jongosselin1 said:
As you may or may not be aware, I have been working for some time to remove my children from television. I do not believe being on TV is beneficial to any of them. They are no longer toddlers that are oblivious to what is going on around them. They are now six and ten, in school and desperately in need of a normal life.
Each of them has experienced negative effects of having their lives so public. Some are struggling with emotional and/or behavioral issues. My goal for my children is for them to have a normal childhood, and gain back their much deserved privacy. This is not about money, this is about my children. No amount of money is worth the price my children are paying. You cannot put a price on childhood. Money comes and goes, but you only have one childhood.
For those questions about money and support, I can say I am supporting my children to the best of my ability. All parties involved know the truth about this. I am and have been actively seeking employment. I have been barred from accepting entertainment deals that would generate income for my family due to contractual obligations. I am also actively looking for a job outside of the entertainment industry and so far, have not secured a position. In the mean time, I have been focusing on spending time with my children and providing a safe, stable, normal and private environment for them!
On October 13, 2010, I went to court to act in the best interest of my children- to remove them from television. The judge respectfully denied my plea, and granted filming rights to their mother. I honor the judge’s decision, but I do not support it. I will not stop fighting to remove my children from television. It is not a child’s job to support themselves, or a lifestyle, they need to be kids. I would like to apologize to my friends, family, and especially my children for not taking a stand earlier in my life and not questioning my decisions to have our lives documented and displayed. I will have to answer to my children for the rest of my life. I will have to live with this guilt the rest of my life. I am truly sorry!
73 sediments (sic) from readers:
You would think that if the judge was impartial and a parent raised concerns regarding their children having issues, the judge would order a Guardian ad Litem and have those kids evaluated. Just taking into consideration the amount of time that these kids have spent filming any ethical judge looking out for the kids best interests would appoint someone to represent them.
Jon needs to take this to the next level.
I wish Jon the best and appreciate that he shared his thoughts. How very, very sad for the Gosselin children.
While I may not always agree with the judges I have been in front of, I can honestly say that none of them would have ever made a decision like this without first appointing counsel for the children, allowing time for a full investigation into accusations their father has made, and only then making a decision. This was just a case of which side can school the other.
Jon can't go into a hearing like this without representation, that is not an insult to him but it's hard for anyone without a lot of experience in a courtroom to go up against this. You need a lawyer speaking for you.
I don't think he should have commented publically but why is Kate's lawyers sooo afraid this information will leak out? And by commenting on Jon's comments on the case, they too are discussing the case--So now they're both in violation. Not to mention all that Kate has said about Jon the past several months. All makes perfect sense now huh--she was feeling threatened by all this and was in full on attack mode. Even the emergence of her "mom" makes sense now.
If they're so sure filming is okay so what are they embarrassed about? I would note he did not say anything bad about Kate, just explained that he is trying to get the kids off TV. And no court order can stop him from making a public apology to the children.
There are many other legal avenues Jon could pursue. This is not the end all be all. Just one avenue is appealing this decision to a higher court, to the appellate courts. Depending on whether the judge is just a commissioner or referee, he could request a rehearing with a different judge. Many other options. But for pity sake before he does anything more he needs a lawyer who has experience both in entertainment law, family law, and children's law.
One judge does not have all the power to stop this. Jon has several appellate rights he could exhaust if he is serious about really putting an end to this.
And I would note that frankly any judge in PA would have a conflict of interest. The kids bring lots of good will and money to PA. It would take a judge willing to go against the general flow of the state beuracracy that loves the good will this family has brought.
Maybe TLC paid the Judge off, who knows, the way that network is I wouldn't doubt it.
As I said on the previous thread, I find it truly frightening that a judge can approve children working to support the lifestyle of one parent while the second parent objects.
And I would note that frankly any judge in PA would have a conflict of interest. The kids bring lots of good will and money to PA.
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This may have been true when they were filmed at the local tourist attractions -- Hersheypark, Dutch Wonderland, Young Chef's Academy, Sesame Place, Crayola, Please Touch Museum, Hand's On House, plus many others. However, their filming in recent months has taken them out of state. I really don't think that they bring "good will" to the state. At one time, when they were touted as "Pennsylvania's Treasures" this may have been true, but not any more. She certainly doesn't generate favorable responses from the locals.
I agree about the need for a bull-dog attorney. I know several in the area, but the question is to what extent (and expense) he wants to pursue this.
I agree 100%
Admin: One judge does not have all the power to stop this. Jon has several appellate rights he could exhaust if he is serious about really putting an end to this.
But, realistically how does someone with limited funds fight their way through all of the steps it will take to accomplish this?
Admin: At your earliest convenience please post the county and or judges's name that made this decision. Obviously one parent at least is looking out for the needs of these children and the PA laws should do so as well. Thank you.
Admin, any idea what happened to that woman lawyer he hired a while back, after List? She seemed to be the real deal. And if funds are the issue, I'm sure one of there would be plenty of good lawyers who would take up this cause pro bono, if not because of the cause itself, but for the publicity. I'm thinking Geoffery Fieger, Gloria Allred, that Kelly guy who represented Ron Goldman's family . . . someone media savvy and used to the limelight, who won't be intimidated by the likes of TLC.
Admin: Maybe this has been publicized on a Friday for a reason, because TLC knows no one can do anything about this until Monday? I am furious at the judge who allowed this to happen with the obvious protest of a responsible parent to put a stop to the filming of these children. At least one parent is thinking of their childrens' childhood and trying to put a stop to a huge corporation (TLC) and the children's mother (KATE GREEDLIN) from profiting once more off the backs of 8 innocent children. I hope Jon prevails at some point.
So don't you think the judge would call
the kids in and ask more about filming to get their true feelings. I have a hard time accepting that a judge would see this to be in their best interests. We are missing something here.
Admin, what CAN we do to support Jon? And more importantly, the children?
Crabitha Codswallop said... Admin, what CAN we do to support Jon? And more importantly, the children?
Crabitha, I really don't know anymore. Other than not watching the show. Problem is even if everyone here did not watch the show, I can assure you it would only make a very small dent in the ratings if anything. I think the only thing we can do is hope for time to pass and people to get sick of this family. I'm afraid it's one of those things that must run its course.
I'm a little confused about what Momjian has told radar. This was not a custody hearing and the gag order came from the custody judge in another court, I thought. I am so disappointed that Jon appeared without representation. Kate's TLC big guns would of course rule the day. I had no idea that he had no lawyer. I am hopeful that he regroups with Paul Peterson's full assistance.
How do you force children to work? According to TLC & the PA DOL they were not even considered employed in the beginning, they were participants! TLC saw no need for work permits and all of a sudden, they are forced to keep filming? Infuriates me.
How convenient that after all of 'Mom of KT's posts have disappeared (she supposedly requested they be deleted) she posts an apology --
Mom of KT says: "I am posting these comments to apologize to my family (specifically Kevin and Jodi) for the comments I made about them. It was wrong to say those things in a public forum (or anywhere actually). I went against my own motto: If you can’t say anything nice, don’t say anything at all.I am sorry, and it won’t happen again."
October 14, 2010 at 12:00 pm
So Momjian must sanction Kate's very poor "performance" on Regis show that Anderson Cooper co hosted. Pathetic.
Oh my gosh, people are absolutely insane when it comes to defending Kate. They are accusing Jon of bad-mouthing her (something SHE does all the time) and nowhere does he mention her at all. They are more delighted that 'Jon lost and Kate won' than those kids. The Kate freaks forget there are 8 little kids who don't have or get a voice in all this, and they are so busy doing happy dances over this latest development, it makes me gag.
Admin, did I understand you correctly that Jon went into this without an attorney present? That makes me seriously wonder what is wrong with this picture? Why would he do that? He knows what the TLC people are like and even with an attorney he is doomed, but really, is it because he has no funds? Something here is just off.
Another question. Why has no guardian ad litem been assigned to this case? Is PA this corrupt that an obscure piece of trailer trash can have 8 children and exploit them to the point of her now being a millionaire and a court will not allow the father to have any input in that decision? Jon has been treated like sh** in the courts of that state from the very beginning. Unless someone steps up and offers to help him, I fear for him. Kate eats up and spits out anything or anyone that gets in her way. But she is not the all powerful Oz at all times. Someday this will all come back to bite her in the butt, but it will have destroyed her children that she claims to love so much. What is wrong with this court system?
As for the fanatical fans who are gloating and high fiving right now -- let them have their fun, she can't win forever. There is too much information out there now and people have seen her and are watching for her to do something to screw things up, it's just a matter of time. Her arrogance and control issues (which is just a form of bullying) will destroy her eventually. The sad thing is, her children are and will pay the ultimate price.
Mom of KT says: "I am posting these comments to apologize to my family (specifically Kevin and Jodi) for the comments I made about them. It was wrong to say those things in a public forum (or anywhere actually). I went against my own motto: If you can’t say anything nice, don’t say anything at all.I am sorry, and it won’t happen again."
October 14, 2010 at 12:00 pm
So Momjian must sanction Kate's very poor "performance" on Regis show that Anderson Cooper co hosted. Pathetic.
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I must really be tired, but what does Kate's attorney, Momijan, have to do with Kate's mom posting on the blogs? Did I miss something?
I think it's disgusting if the Kate fans are high-fiving over this. Have they met the kids? Have they talked to the children about how they feel about this? Would they make 150 episodes of a TV series and strip their own children of privacy more and more each episode that airs?
It's not even so much the hours of filming to me anymore, although that remains a huge concern. The loss of privacy is really the bigger issue for me now. Privacy is a beautiful sacred thing and every single one of those eight kids has had it stripped from them without consent.
I applaud Jon for his efforts but he is very green and not in the environmental way. Pro per wasn't the smartest way to go.
Kate SEES and KNOWS that her kids are having emotional and behavioral problems but ignores it. That is CHILD ABUSE.
TLC can retool the show all they want but they will never find a way to justify Kate and the abuse she is inflicting on her children.
Are we being punked? Seriously?
Kate can go on Regis & Kelly and bad mouth Jon and bad mouth the custody arrangement and not get in any trouble...
and Jon Tweets about losing a court case without even mentioning Kate by name and he gets in all kinds of trouble?
Where is the fairness in all of this? How blind do people need to be to see that Jon is being treated so unfairly and so poorly by the courts in PA?
Can't people see that Kate was so miserable to be married to that her husband had to leave to protect his sanity?
How does Kate sleep at night, knowing SHE is the one who ended the marriage and pushed Jon away, and is now rewarded with EVERYTHING and Jon gets nothing...not even a say in how the kids should be raised.
I hate Kate more and more every single day. I really do. She is one evil, vindictive piece of trash. No wonder she was smiling like a lotto winner the other day. Once again, she gets what she wants and could care less about others.
And Mark Momjian should be sanctioned or whatever you call it for commenting about the case to Radar Online. What he did is no different than what Jon did on Twitter.
This is why I got out of divorce law. It's so vindictive. One party says something, the other responds, tit for tat, back and forth, he said she said, horrible. Divorce is horrible, terrible, sad, pathetic.
Kate and Jon have 50-50 legal custody. Jon will be running to court until they are 18 anytime he doesn't like something Kate does. From traveling out of state, to disagreements about medical, religious or educational decisions, to the filming issue. He is in for a long, long road if he wants any say in how his children are being raised.
Would they make 150 episodes of a TV series and strip their own children of privacy more and more each episode that airs?
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Yes, they would. They would foam at the mouth over the chance. Sheeple are different from you and me. They are uneducated, in a low socio-economic class, and as such, they see materialism as a god. They only see the children as a means to their ends, which, of course, is wealth and status. They remind me of those in the "if it feel good, do it" era. In this case, it's "have multiples, will travel" (and get a new house, new clothing, new cars, ad nauseum).
When the children are in therapy, the sheeple will put the blame on Jon, while Kate will still be on her marble pedestal for providing them with the best of everything that money can buy. Sheeple don't get it now, and they never will. They're dumb enough to stand still to be sheared in the dead of winter rather than in the spring.
And yes I agree Kate's attorney did the exact same thing. Just because Jon spoke up first (sorry, he's not allowed to tell the public he is against filming? He didn't say anything about Kate) and the attorney responding second doesn't make it any less of a violation of a court order.
I wish I could get these people in front of some judges I know. Things would be very different.
Julianna said... Would they make 150 episodes of a TV series and strip their own children of privacy more and more each episode that airs?
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Yes, they would. They would foam at the mouth over the chance. Sheeple are different from you and me
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That's really the heart of the reason why we cannot find common ground. Our values systems are so vastly different. We see a problem with stripping a child of his or her privacy, they don't. We see a problem with children working and not the other way around, they don't. We see a problem with their mother pissing away every last dime, they don't.
We just can't meet anywhere in the middle when people are coming from fundamentally different values systems. I think it's one thing to be behind Kate when this started but at this point, I just don't understand it. I really don't. There's massive outcry over what is happening and she still has supporters.
....but why is Kate's lawyers sooo afraid this information will leak out?
I think it's because it puts Kate in a bad light, revealing how far she's willing to go to film these kids even when the other parent objects. Jon has been personified as the "bad parent" in mainstream media, ever since his Ed Hardy days (which he cannot seem to shake-off) while Kate has always been deemed as the "good parent". If mainstream media starts siding with him, it'll only hurt Kate's further pursuit of fame and fortune. It's not about the kids for her, but how much more fame and fortune she can achieve. It's sad really.
In hindsight, I think Jon now regrets having caved-in and allowing TLC to film the kids for Kate Plus 8. When you're in the middle of the mess, you cannot have clear perspective about what's going around you until you get out. Maybe he watched this season and was just as appalled about what he saw (as we all were), or even his own kids complained about it. It's possible he lurks around these blogs and finally realized what most of us have complained about - the exploitation of his kids at the expense of their privacy.
If they're so sure filming is okay so what are they embarrassed about?
It destroys the pretty image Kate has created that filming is not harming her kids. To hear the other parent say that his kids are experiencing emotional/behavioral issues shows that filming has had some negative impact on the kids.
This is not about "sheeple" vs. "haterz". IT'S ABOUT THE GOSSELIN KIDS! Jon's win would have been a WIN FOR THE KIDS. That's all I care about.
I really, really want to believe in Jon and that his message was truly heartfelt. He has lost my trust, so I hope he does prove me wrong. Am I the only one who first thought this was another TLC ruse when seeing it on radaronline/perezhilton?** It's not the first time Jon has tried to stop filming and/or protect his kids and the media catches on i.e. Jon's cease-and-desist letter, custody during DWTS. Could it be possible that TLC allowed Jon to tweet that message, [TLC] knowing they would then have radaronline report about it with Kate's lawyer commenting on it? If TLC/Kate's PR are doing this to garner more ratings, that's just sick and twisted! Hopefully this supposed gag order (which Jon allegedly violated) holds true for Kate so she cannot run to mainstream media with a new sob story.
**Ironically, TLC also just started promotion for Sarah Palin's Alaska, so if a Kate Plus 8 Alaskan special is to exist, these recent tactics (i.e. Kate's Mom message, Jon's tweet) to rile up the Gosselin community and garner ratings would make sense.
It gives Kate a platform to help promote her new special on talk shows - discuss Jon's latest action and show how the kids had fun in Alaska.
SICK. SICK. SICK...if true.
When do the kids get a break? They are in school full time, then will they be expected to film the second they get a three-day weekend or winter break or spring break? God knows they spent their entire summer this past summer filming. So basically now they are expected to go to school then when they are out of school, work some more for their mother.
When I was a kid summers involved the pool, camp and friends over. That's how things should be for these poor kids.
There's massive outcry over what is happening and she still has supporters.
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I also think that the sheeples' tenacity (as a collective group) has much to do with it. There is strength in numbers. Even if they were to have a spiritual rebirth and see the errors of their ways, they've been so vehement in their support of Kate that they never would even come close to admitting that these children might be emotionally damaged by filming.
They are a die-hard flock, stubborn as the day is long...and pathetic.
Wow, this is unbelievable. Why has there been no lawyer appointed for the children? This seems like a basic need to me, but I'm no law expert. I think the judge probably was bought off by TLC; at least it wouldn't surprise me. For the judge to rule in favor of the kids would mean casting TLC in a bad light and Penn. state labor/child welfare agencies as incompetent and possibly corrupt (which I believe they are).
JON...IF YOU ARE READING THIS, COZY UP TO PAUL PETERSEN IMMEDIATELY!!! Sorry to yell, but I think he is there and waiting with all the resources needed to put an end to this travesty. They have attorneys, counselors, even a detox center (maybe they can send Kate there to get over her fame addiction). I'm sure he can help you; don't go back to court again without an attorney for yourself and another for your children.
OMG, this is all so unbelieveable. I'll be praying for those children!
Admin said: And I would note that frankly any judge in PA would have a conflict of interest. The kids bring lots of good will and money to PA. It would take a judge willing to go against the general flow of the state beuracracy that loves the good will this family has brought.
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What a good point. Is it possible/legal to have a judge from another state hear the appeal if Jon decides to go that route?
I disagree with those that say that Jon should not have commented about his court loss to prevent the children to be filmed. No matter what mistakes he has made in the past, he has tried to stop the continual torture of his children by having their whole childhood made public entertainment. Of course Kate and her evil doers are furious that Jon has made it known that she fought him in court so she could continue to have her children support her through filming. I think Jon should continue to speak out about this and even go to jail if he has to. Those are his children, not TLC's and he loves them! Let him continue to show others the true motivation of Kate. If he can't win against the TLC legal team, let him expose Kate as the fraud she is. She would like everyone to believe that she is Mother of the Year and yet those kids are abused by this.I am sorry but anyone who watches the stuff TLC films is guilty of child exploitation too.
I hope Jon continues to fight and stand up for these children. If they were mine, I wouldn't think twice about spending time in Jail if that was the price I had to pay. Damn it to hell, these kids are being destroyed!
Maybe it's just me, but Jon's tweet SOUNDS like it was written by a lawyer. It sounds too polished and precise. I'm not bashing Jon, it just sounds like a professional's words. If this is the case, WHY did he not have this person in court with him?
Kate + 8 will not survive another season,
if we do not watch the show. TLC will drop Kate like a bad habit when the ratings stay down.
Sure, Kate's wackadoo fans may be numerous, and think that they are powerful, but on their own, they are not enough keep that sh*tty show on the air.
And by the way, they're only as powerful (that includes Kate & TLC) as WE ALLOW THEM TO BE.
To those on the fence about tuning in- remember, you are part of the reason those poor kids cannot live normal lives.
The courts may not be on the kid's side, but we are. And we can make a difference.
Give a damn- free the Gosselin 8!
BOYCOTT Kate + 8!
Now it looks like Jon is in trouble for saying anything at all. There was a gag order. Of course because kate knows it looks bad for her. Now she's going to the courts to get him in trouble. Story from ROL.
Admin said.... And I would note that frankly any judge in PA would have a conflict of interest. The kids bring lots of good will and money to PA. It would take a judge willing to go against the general flow of the state beuracracy that loves the good will this family has brought.
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I think that's a bit of a stretch. Kate Gosselin is not a national treasure. She is not a good will ambassador by any stretch of the imagination. It isn't like someone's trying to shut down Graceland. I really hate to see her get credit where none is due.
Well, Kate's lawyer violated the gag order as well...As far as Kate going to court to get Jon in trouble? I don't buy it....this whole debacle would become public at that point.
Can someone please explain the ruling? I don't get it.
How could any judge rule that it is better for children under the age of consent to work than for children not to work?
This seems like it is a parental ruling--that is Jon vs Kate and Kate won. Not taking anything the kids are experiencing into account.
Please, someone explain this. Seriously.
heather
Jon is up against "bullies" who care more about dollars than children. We can do a lot by "voting with our remotes." If Kate G tanks, TLC will not keep supporting her and her lifestyle. The kids have gotten much older, lost the cute stage, and really do need to be kids. Why should any child have to support themselves and their mother's lifestyle? Just hope Jon hasn't awakened too late. Another thing, judges used to be lawyers. I learned the hard way that you don't appear in court without an attorney, no way. It was an expensive lesson.
Cathy518, do you think that if Jon went to jail, when he got out he wishes would be granted and the kids wouldn't be filmed anymore? How would that help anything?
I don't buy it....this whole debacle would become public at that point.
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Of course! That's the whole point -- using any means to keep her in the public eye! Why do you think her lawyer responded so quickly! Publicity!
Heather said...
Can someone please explain the ruling? I don't get it.
How could any judge rule that it is better for children under the age of consent to work than for children not to work?
I think it goes back to the same 'ole issue -- TLC argues the kids are NOT 'working' and it appears that the judge agrees and since the child labor laws are so poor the judge had nothing to support a ruling with. Or, IF they are working, the judge doesn't think that it's harmful to them. Or, whether they're working or not, the arguments against filming them weren't strong enough to show that it's harmful to them.
It's obvious to me that the judge doesn't believe having cameras in the kids' faces is harmful to them.
The kids have been considered 'participants' all along and supposedly the poor child labor laws in PA don't apply to them. UNTIL new laws in PA are passed, film companies and parents can get away with exploiting their children in the entertainment industry.
Vanessa said...
Maybe it's just me, but Jon's tweet SOUNDS like it was written by a lawyer. It sounds too polished and precise. I'm not bashing Jon, it just sounds like a professional's words. If this is the case, WHY did he not have this person in court with him?
I agree that the tweet was polished. I believe he had help writing it.
No one knows who Jon had with him in court. Let's give Jon the benefit of the doubt that he had representation and that the judge simply ruled against him.
I truly want to believe that someone in this family has finally decided to step up and parent those children, but the realist in me agrees with Kelly. How many times before has Jon developed a concience when the money train needed a little boost, only to have those newfound scruples crumble into dust when it came time to sign on the dotted line? And for him to show up unrepresented in court to oppose the lawyer who allegedly wiped the floor with him in the divorce? He's either performing according to script, the stupidest man alive or...I don't know, I can't think of a third option.
I so hope I'm wrong.
Admin -
Do we really know that Jon had no lawyer? I missed that. I thought his lawyer was Mary Vidas after he fired Anthony List. He has not said that Mary Vidas wasn't in court with him has he?
Kate always said and recently said it again in the past year or so that if one or more didn;t want to film that they wouldn't film. Yes, Kate said this again when she made the rounds on tv shows last fall.
So, just like last time this year, Jon said no filming and no filming was done. So what is different this go around? Please someone answer this. SO Jon needs to go through the film footage of Kate going to all the talk shows where Kate admits that if one doesn't want to be filmed than no filming will happen. And he needs to get the children to talk to a professional and have it filmed. That way he will be ready to go again in front a judge and show that Kate agreed to the no filming plus one or more of the kids don't want to filmed and it must be stopped.
Also, Jon should produce a rough spreadsheet of Kate's fiances that prove that she has at least 1, 2 or 3 million to support the kids without further filming. The judge may not be aware that Kate is a mult-millioniare and more filming of his kids is not necessary to support the kids.
Also, can't Jon sue TLC for continuing filming when the family made the above agreement.
Please someone address this.
It's obvious to me that the judge doesn't believe having cameras in the kids' faces is harmful to them.
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I'm not so sure this was a matter of a judge making a decision on whether or not cameras are harmful to the kids. It could be that the argument was who had the RIGHT to make the decision to film, and the judge found in Kate's favor.
i appreciate the response, but it doesn't answer the question. Kate and Jon are the parents, not TLC. So the judge can't rule in favor of TLC. This is about kids working. Is all this just semantics and smoke and mirrors because reality show employees are just participants? How could that apply when the children are working, dragged out of school, schlepped from state to state to state to film? How can any judge find that behavior acceptable?
Unless there are NOW stipulations on what/when/where the kids can film that isn't public information. Otherwise, I seriously don't understand -- this was in a family court, wasn't it? A custody hearing?
heather
maggie said... So, just like last time this year, Jon said no filming and no filming was done. So what is different this go around? Please someone answer this.
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But Jon backed down and filming began again. It is said that he signed a contract/agreement with TLC for $ in exchange for letting the kids be filmed again.
Was he in court fighting what he agreed to? I don't think we have all the facts.
It's easy to sit in the relative comfort of our own homes free of the controls of a demanding, money hungry shrew who controls our kids and say what Jon should do. I doubt it's as easy as we make it all sound.
I'm confused so perhaps Admin can weigh in here.
If it were me in this situation, I would be on the phone with AMC and Paul Petersen so fast it would make your head spin. Jon HAS to be aware of this group and that they would help him. It makes no sense to me to go to court without an attorney. If he is truly broke (which he may be) and without a lawyer (because I don't think he makes a compelling case for a pro bono atty) he's in trouble without some help. Most laypeople need help figuring out court rules and hearing protocol. It's possible he thought he could just walk in there and state his case - but this is NOT a speeding ticket.
If he's having financial problems that preclude him from hiring a lawyer, that is an even more compelling reason why he needs to call AMC immediately.
The fact that it appears he has never called them makes me a bit suspicious. If he's sincere, he should be reaching out to anyone who can help him.
Darcy, to to this thread
http://www.realitytvkids.com/2010/10/family-law-judge-permits-kate-to.html#comments
and read the comments by "anon on this."
This is not a political statement by any means and I know a lot of people do not like him, but Bill O'Reilly makes a point of showing the picture of certain judges make bone headed rulings in cases (like a judge that gave a convicted child molester probation). He will show their name and photo on his show. Wonder if this judge who ruled on the Gosselin 10 should have his mug on Bill O'Reilly's show. Maybe the public should know that this judge has no regard for the exploitation of children.
"How could that apply when the children are working, dragged out of school, schlepped from state to state to state to film? How can any judge find that behavior acceptable?"
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I did answer the question. It's not a matter of whether the judge found that acceptable or not. I don't think that this had anything to do with whether filming is harmful, or if they should be taken out of school. It would seem that this is a matter of RIGHTS. Does Kate have the RIGHT to decide whether the kids will be filmed? The judge decided that yes, she does. A little off-topic, but nevertheless, an analogy. Most people believe that the Civil War was fought over slavery. It was not. It was not about the inhumane treatment of slaves, or whether slavery was right or wrong. It was fought over STATES' RIGHTS...do the states have a RIGHT to sanction slavery or abolish it?
"It's easy to sit in the relative comfort of our own homes free of the controls of a demanding, money hungry shrew who controls our kids and say what Jon should do. I doubt it's as easy as we make it all sound."
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Absolutely. Nothing is easy in all of this, and we don't know what he has done, who he has reached out to, on what the judge's decision was based, or anything else except that Kate has the right to decide if the kids should be filmed.
Lisa, I agree. I imagine the sheeple think this judge has justified that filming is okay. However it's one person's decision on the bench. If you think judges don't make bonehead moves every day, just take a look at your city's appellate court docket, which should be open to the public. Step inside and watch some hearings. Judges are overturned day after day after day, on the order of hundreds and hundreds of times a day across the country.
I agree that what was decided is that Kate can overrule Jon's desire not to have the kids filmed, and not whether filming is beneficial.
When there is a divorce, legal custody, or in short the right to make "big" decisions, is split 50-50. If you can't agree, you have to drag the other person to court to have the judge decide. For instance if one divorced parent wants to raise the child Jewish and the other Christian and you've reached a stalemate, you go to court and the judge decides who gets to decide on that issue (real cases have involved this very example).
That said, I find it sick that Jon has to go all the way to court to fight something like this. Why can't Kate respect that he doesn't want his children filmed? She didn't respect that he didn't like Steve either, he said that it made him uncomfortable (he said this on Larry King) and Kate, once again, ignored him. She has absolutely zero respect for her children's father. She never did. In the interest of peace and harmony for the children's sake can't she just yeild on this? Oh right cause it's Kate and it doesn't matter what it is she's gotta win.
Administrator said... That said, I find it sick that Jon has to go all the way to court to fight something like this. Why can't Kate respect that he doesn't want his children filmed? She didn't respect that he didn't like Steve either, he said that it made him uncomfortable (he said this on Larry King) and Kate, once again, ignored him. She has absolutely zero respect for her children's father. She never did. In the interest of peace and harmony for the children's sake can't she just yeild on this? Oh right cause it's Kate and it doesn't matter what it is she's gotta win.
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I guess it goes back to Kate's narcissim (sp?). Kate only cares about Kate. She doesn't respect anyone. She clearly does not respect her children. If she cared about them, she would see what Jon sees, that filming is affecting them adversly.
Administrator said...
I agree that what was decided is that Kate can overrule Jon's desire not to have the kids filmed, and not whether filming is beneficial.
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Thanks, Admin. I have a question, though. Does Kate have primary custody, or do Kate and Jon have joint custody? If it is joint custody, then why doesn't each of them have equal rights in deciding if the children should be filmed?
Primary and physical custody are different than what we're talking about. Legal custody is the issue, legal custody is who has the right to make decisions. It is almost always 50-50 absent horrible abuse or a parent in jail. That's simply not the case here, Jon wouldn't be taking Kate to court unless he had 50-50, because if Kate had 100% Kate could make all the decisions and Jon be damned.
When you have 50-50, if you disagree you can have a stalemate. That's what the judge is for when there are disputes as to legal decisions, such as in this case filming. The judge is the tie-breaking vote.
As you can imagine, sharing legal custody can mean 18 years of misery for couples who do not get along. 18 years of potentially running back to court anytime you disagree.
"Jail?? said... Cathy518, do you think that if Jon went to jail, when he got out he wishes would be granted and the kids wouldn't be filmed anymore? How would that help anything?"
Of course Jon speaking up and risking the ire of the court in itself would not do anything except influence public opinion. People who watch this show are those with public opinions. The advertisers who pay for this show are VERY concerned with public opinion. Viewership does get something of a bump from controversy and that is why anyone who disagrees with the kids filming and then watches the show is just as bad as a sheeple,in my opinion. But, I believe that there is a tipping point and that we have started to see it with the slip in ratings. To expose Kate for who she is is to create more people who won't be able to stomach watching her exploit her kids. To know Kate, is to hate Kate! Really, if a gag order was not helpful to her cause, her lawyer wouldn't be complaining about it being violated. I have yet to understand how this violates a gag order that is about child custody though.
I hope Jon continues to fight and not give up. He may have lost the battle but the war goes on. Those poor kids are caught in the crossfire.
OK, then the questions is: Why is Kate permitted to decide whether the kids work and Jon has no say? What would be the reason? What reason makes her the better choice of the two?
heather
Anonymous said...
OK, then the questions is: Why is Kate permitted to decide whether the kids work and Jon has no say? What would be the reason? What reason makes her the better choice of the two?
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Because she has a good attorney?
cathy518 said... I have yet to understand how this violates a gag order that is about child custody though.
I have not seen the wording in the gag order. Is it available? Does the gag order pertain only to not talking about custody?
heather said... OK, then the questions is: Why is Kate permitted to decide whether the kids work and Jon has no say? What would be the reason? What reason makes her the better choice of the two?
Perhaps the ruling was that Kate has the right to film the kids when SHE has custody and that as long as they're not being abused Jon cannot stop it. And, vice versa if Jon wanted to film and Kate said no.
Without knowing specifics from the hearing, it's apparent Jon's side didn't prove their case - whatever it was. But, for it to have lasted 6 hours, there must have been witnesses with testimony and I wonder if any were psychologists. I also believe the outcome has something to do with the amount of money each side was able to spend and we know that issue is lopsided.
Question, does Jon have the right to take his kids to a psychologist without Khate's knowledge or approval? I would think if they were to start seeing a psychologist, that once the damage can be proven, then Jon would have a leg to stand on, no?
I believe the show will lose its' relevancy and will be pulled, before Jon could get a judge to rule on this again. But, I'm w/the above poster, just HOW sincere is Jon in his attempts to get his kids off TV? I guess time will tell.
Additionally, I don't think Jon is 'sharp' enough to go to court without an attorney. He's not able to think fast on his feet, not to mention, he probably would be intimidated by the judge. Afterall, he was intimidated by Kate for all those years.
Freaks works for me!
http://www.news4jax.com/entertainment/23162236/detail.html
Administrator said...
I agree that what was decided is that Kate can overrule Jon's desire not to have the kids filmed, and not whether filming is beneficial.
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Thanks, Admin. I have a question, though. Does Kate have primary custody, or do Kate and Jon have joint custody? If it is joint custody, then why doesn't each of them have equal rights in deciding if the children should be filmed?
Darcy, to to this thread
http://www.realitytvkids.com/2010/10/family-law-judge-permits-kate-to.html#comments
and read the comments by "anon on this."
So don't you think the judge would call
the kids in and ask more about filming to get their true feelings. I have a hard time accepting that a judge would see this to be in their best interests. We are missing something here.
Admin, any idea what happened to that woman lawyer he hired a while back, after List? She seemed to be the real deal. And if funds are the issue, I'm sure one of there would be plenty of good lawyers who would take up this cause pro bono, if not because of the cause itself, but for the publicity. I'm thinking Geoffery Fieger, Gloria Allred, that Kelly guy who represented Ron Goldman's family . . . someone media savvy and used to the limelight, who won't be intimidated by the likes of TLC.
While I may not always agree with the judges I have been in front of, I can honestly say that none of them would have ever made a decision like this without first appointing counsel for the children, allowing time for a full investigation into accusations their father has made, and only then making a decision. This was just a case of which side can school the other.
Jon can't go into a hearing like this without representation, that is not an insult to him but it's hard for anyone without a lot of experience in a courtroom to go up against this. You need a lawyer speaking for you.
I don't think he should have commented publically but why is Kate's lawyers sooo afraid this information will leak out? And by commenting on Jon's comments on the case, they too are discussing the case--So now they're both in violation. Not to mention all that Kate has said about Jon the past several months. All makes perfect sense now huh--she was feeling threatened by all this and was in full on attack mode. Even the emergence of her "mom" makes sense now.
If they're so sure filming is okay so what are they embarrassed about? I would note he did not say anything bad about Kate, just explained that he is trying to get the kids off TV. And no court order can stop him from making a public apology to the children.
Kate + 8 will not survive another season,
if we do not watch the show. TLC will drop Kate like a bad habit when the ratings stay down.
Sure, Kate's wackadoo fans may be numerous, and think that they are powerful, but on their own, they are not enough keep that sh*tty show on the air.
And by the way, they're only as powerful (that includes Kate & TLC) as WE ALLOW THEM TO BE.
To those on the fence about tuning in- remember, you are part of the reason those poor kids cannot live normal lives.
The courts may not be on the kid's side, but we are. And we can make a difference.
Give a damn- free the Gosselin 8!
BOYCOTT Kate + 8!
Wow, this is unbelievable. Why has there been no lawyer appointed for the children? This seems like a basic need to me, but I'm no law expert. I think the judge probably was bought off by TLC; at least it wouldn't surprise me. For the judge to rule in favor of the kids would mean casting TLC in a bad light and Penn. state labor/child welfare agencies as incompetent and possibly corrupt (which I believe they are).
JON...IF YOU ARE READING THIS, COZY UP TO PAUL PETERSEN IMMEDIATELY!!! Sorry to yell, but I think he is there and waiting with all the resources needed to put an end to this travesty. They have attorneys, counselors, even a detox center (maybe they can send Kate there to get over her fame addiction). I'm sure he can help you; don't go back to court again without an attorney for yourself and another for your children.
OMG, this is all so unbelieveable. I'll be praying for those children!
I disagree with those that say that Jon should not have commented about his court loss to prevent the children to be filmed. No matter what mistakes he has made in the past, he has tried to stop the continual torture of his children by having their whole childhood made public entertainment. Of course Kate and her evil doers are furious that Jon has made it known that she fought him in court so she could continue to have her children support her through filming. I think Jon should continue to speak out about this and even go to jail if he has to. Those are his children, not TLC's and he loves them! Let him continue to show others the true motivation of Kate. If he can't win against the TLC legal team, let him expose Kate as the fraud she is. She would like everyone to believe that she is Mother of the Year and yet those kids are abused by this.I am sorry but anyone who watches the stuff TLC films is guilty of child exploitation too.
I hope Jon continues to fight and stand up for these children. If they were mine, I wouldn't think twice about spending time in Jail if that was the price I had to pay. Damn it to hell, these kids are being destroyed!
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